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RE: Blind people using setup.exe?

On Monday, June 27, 2005 9:44 AM, Nikhil Nair wrote

> On Sun, 26 Jun 2005, Igor Pechtchanski wrote:
>> On Sun, 26 Jun 2005, Nikhil Nair wrote:
>>> [...]
>> I'm sorry to say that the chooser is currently not accessible.  I'm
>> sure some setup developers have half-baked attempts to decouple the
>> logic from the chooser in their private sandboxes (I do), but
>> nothing worth even showing to others, apparently.
>> Assuming you have the ability to edit files, as a temporary
>> workaround you could add the following line to your
>> /etc/setup/installed.db (in alphabetical order): 
>> emacs emacs-0-0.tar.bz2 0
>> and re-run setup.  It should now "upgrade" the version of emacs it
>> thinks you have (0-0), effectively installing emacs.
>> HTH,
>> 	Igor
> Thanks, Igor - that workaround performed flawlessly.
> Am I right in suspecting that, if I were to use this method for
> another package which had unsatisfied dependencies, setup.exe
> wouldnt' sort out those dependencies for me?  Or would it assume the
> dependencies had changed since version 0-0, and handle them
> seamlessly? 
> On a different note, could anyone spare a few minutes to describe
> exactly how you operate the chooser, as a sighted user?  If I can
> understand what I should be doing with the mouse, I may be able to
> get my screen reader to emulate that; it has quite a bit of power to
> simulate clicks, holding the mouse buttons etc., though most blind
> people don't use them since ordinary keyboard access is so much
> easier.  Applications which need mouse manipulation of that sort are
> generally considered to be inaccessible, but that doesn't mean you
> can't get them working if you know what to do. 
> Cheers,
> Nikhil.


I will try to explain how I use setup.exe with a mouse.  If any of this
stuff doesn't translate well, let me know.

I usually make sure I have the latest version of setup.exe.  I run it
from my browser.

I run Internet Explorer and browse to

I am behind a proxy server that requires authentication, so I have an
extra pop-up box asking me for my user name and password to get to the

I click on the Install or update now link which points to

The pop-up box from Internet Explorer asks me if I want to Open it or
Save it (as well as Cancel or More Info).

I choose to Open it.

The Cygwin Setup wizard opens after the download finishes.

It says Cygwin Net Release Setup Program and has a back button
(currently grayed out), a next button, and cancel button.

I click on Next.  You can also use ALT-N.

There are three radio buttons on the next screen labeled Choose A
Download Source.

The top radio button is labeled Install from Internet and (for my
system) is enabled by default.  It has a hot-letter of 'I', so ALT-I
should select it also.

There is also Download Without Installing (hot-letter 'D') and Install
from Local Directory (hot-letter 'L')

I click on Next again.

The next screen is called Select Root Install Directory.

Mine is the default location of C:\cygwin and I believe the other
default values are what most people use.  You can install it for All
users (hot-letter 'A') or for Just Yourself (hot-letter 'M') and have a
default text file type of DOS (hot-letter 'O') or Unix (hot-letter 'U').
The defaults are All Users and Unix.

I click on Next again.

The next screen is called Select Local Package Directory.

I changed my local package directory to a generic temporary folder
because I delete the downloaded package information after they are
installed.  You can do whatever you want on this screen or leave it at
the default.

I click on Next again.

The next screen is called Select Your Internet Connection.

There are three radio buttons to choose from on this screen: Direct
Connection (hot-letter 'D'), Use IE5 Settings (hot-letter 'I'), and Use
HTTP/FTP Proxy (hot-letter 'P').  Since I have a proxy server I must use
for Internet Access, I choose to Use IE5 Settings.  The proxy settings
are already set up in Internet Explorer.  If I had to enter them
manually, I would choose Use HTTP/FTP Proxy and then I would have to
enter the Proxy Host (hot-letter 'H') and Port (hot-letter 't')

I click on Next again.

A Cygwin setup.exe generated pop-up box prompts me for my Proxy User ID
(hot-letter 'U') and Password (hot-letter 'P').  The box says Proxy
Authentication Required as the title and has the text Proxy
Authorization Required above the two text entry fields.

I enter my information and hit ENTER.  This is the same as pressing the
'OK' button at this point.

The next screen is Choose A Download Site.

There is a long list of Available Download Sites.  You can CTRL-CLICK on
them to select multiple entries.  I have selected
There is also another text field called User URL where you can enter a
custom URL.

There don't seem to be any hot-letters on this screen.

I click on Next again.

It downloads the compressed setup information file and opens the Select
Packages screen.

There are four radio buttons across the top as well as a button that
cycles through different display options for the listing of packages.

The radio buttons are labeled Keep (hot-letter 'K'), Prev (hot-letter
'C'), Curr (hot-letter 'C') and Exp (hot-letter 'x').

The button is labeled View (hot-letter 'V').  The default view of the
package listing is Category.  This has the packages grouped by
categories in an expandable tree format.

The next view that is available by pressing the View button is called
Full.  It lists all of the packages in a flat list in alphabetical

The next view that is available by pressing the View button is called
Partial.  It looks like the Full listing but only lists those packages
that need to be upgraded or those that need to be installed to satisfy a
dependency or an obsolescence.

The next view that is available by pressing the View button is called Up
To Date.  It looks like the Full listing but only lists those packages
that are completely up to date.

The next view that is available by pressing the View button is called
Not Installed.  It looks like the Full listing but only lists those
packages that are not installed at all.

Pressing the View button again returns you to the Category view.

In the Category view, the column headers in the package listing are
Category, Current (which lists version number), New (which lists a newer
version number or an action to be taken: Keep, Reinstall, Source,
previous version number, Uninstall), Bin? (a check box to check if you
want to install the binary), Src? (a check box to check if you want the
Source), Package (the name of the package followed by a colon a space
and a brief description of the package).

In all other views, there is a Categories column added between Src? and
Package.  This column lists the Category or Categories that a packages
falls into (since a package can be in more than one category).

As you have already discovered, there are no hot-letters and no keyboard
navigation of the package listing.

I set the View to Full.

I slowly scroll down the list using the up / down scroll bar on the
right side of the package listing looking for whatever package it is I
am interested in.

The Current column lists the version numbers of the packages I have
installed and is blank for those that I do not have installed.

The New column lists the version numbers of a newer version of installed
packages (if available), shows 'Keep' if I have the latest version, or
shows 'Skip' if I do not have the package installed.  Clicking once on
the 'Skip' value in the new column select this package for installation
and changes the display to show the version number that will be
displayed.  Some packages have multiple versions available and clicking
on this field again may show another version number or may go back to
'Skip' if only one version is available.  If I click on this field for a
package I already have installed it cycles through Keep, Reinstall,
Source, previous version number, Uninstall.

The Bin? column is set to n/a for packages you have already installed
the binary for or for packages you are Skip'ing and an X marks the check
box by default for new packages you are going to install.

The Src? column is set to n/a for packages that you have already
installed the source for.  It is not selected by default when you
install a new package.  You can and probably will have the binary
package installed for most of the packages but the source for only a
very few or none.  If you are Skip'ing a package, this field is set to

The Category column is as described above.

The Package column is as described above.

Make your selections and click on Next (or use ALT-N).

If you don't make any selections at all, it will install what is
considered the base system or upgrade any packages you already have

The next screen is the Cygwin Setup screen.  It downloads what it needs
to, uninstalls current packages, installs new packages, runs postinstall
scripts, and then opens the final screen Create Icons.

On the Create Icons screen, there are two check boxes: Create icon on
Desktop and Add icon to Start Menu.  The boxes are only checked if the
icons don't exist.

The buttons on the screen are Back (hot-letter 'B'), Finish, and Cancel.
Just hitting enter should default to Finish.

A final tiny screen is displayed that should hopefully say Cygwin Setup,
Installation Complete.

There is an OK button.  Press it, you are done.

I have no idea if this will help you out, I hope it does.  If it doesn't
just tell me (and the list) what else you need.  You are the person
doing the asking, but I am certain you aren't the only one who can
benefit from the answers.


PS - I apologize in advance for the legal disclaimer at the bottom of my
email message.  This is tacked on by our SMTP gateway and I have no
control over it.

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