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Re: html email
- From: Ethan Tira-Thompson <ejt at andrew dot cmu dot edu>
- To: cygwin-talk at sourceware dot org
- Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 17:31:07 -0400
- Subject: Re: html email
- References: <1BBF464ECC68FB4AA7EF4AB997CC0731019084D8@NA-PA-VBE01.na.tibco.com>
- Reply-to: The Cygwin-Talk Maiming List <cygwin-talk at cygwin dot com>
Combining replies below:
"Mike"? Who's "Mike"? :-)
Err, sorry I meant Matt (I have a friend with a similar user id whose
name is Mike)
I think we were on the same page. My point is the "HTML mail is
EVIL" comment is definitely a matter of opinion. I happen to prefer
messages which word wrap properly and support rich text.
Opinion? Um... I did mean "HTML *mail*" above, and since I don't think
you're disagreeing with that, I apologize for the ambiguity.
For instance, take a look at what happened here:
For instance, you're right that it's non-homogenous. But take
conclusion: some people want to use lynx to view the web, that's fine
there are ways to give them a usable experience (e.g. 'alt' tags for
images), but non-homogeneity isn't a good enough reason to deny the
UGLY!!!! You *prefer* that mess? It just gets worse and worse and
the thread bounces around. Did you reply 'its' to my "For
instance..." or is that just continuation with bad wrapping? People
have to work through the formatting instead of just reading the
actual content. This doesn't happen when things are <blockquote>'d
in HTML mail.
A second point is that I generally deal with adults, not font-happy
kids. If someone thought it worth their time to apply some
formatting to make something clear, I want to see it because they
probably had a reason for doing so.
Given that I meant /mail/, I think this is irrelevant, but on a
vaguelyRight, which is the author's problem. So complain to the relative
handful of sites that do stupid stuff like that, and appreciate the
*vast majority* which are cleanly styled. And as you point out (and
agrees with the point I'm trying to make), there are well known work-
arounds to strip the style of badly designed pages.
related note, I've seen plenty of illegible or outright unusable web
because some jackass designer assumes that the entire world runs MSIE
default settings. In some cases, it turns out to be a nice but
designer that promptly corrects the problem :-), but it still happens.
Mozilla for Page Style->None.
So to relate back to email, have the server bounce the messages that
are *only* HTML email, and I still see no problem with passing
messages that have both formats. I don't think you're going to have
a problem with people making their mailing list postings into myspace
pages. Only spam bots do that, and there are better ways to block
them that would also prevent them from sending text-only ads.
Oh? Funny, when I look at source, keywords are green, comments are
gray,Is all black preferable to *neither* color scheme? You can only read
highlighting that uses your personal color set?
normal text is cyan, etc, and everything has a dark blue
I mean? :-)
Even if you say 'yes' just to spite me, then just switch to the plain
text if that's really what you believe.
In a word, bandwidth.
It's a mailing list. Doubling a few KB a day is still... just a few
KB a *day*. As for archiving/digests, just include the plain text
version if the HTML is too difficult to process. And it's not that
hard to process -- I've seen plenty of mailing lists which allow the
subscriber to choose their format in order to avoid these issues.
This is the first which blocks HTML altogether, which why I find it
Ah, so now we're talking about Postscript mail?
enscript has HTML output -- see the -W flag.
I'm using XCode, and FYI, Kate has an 'export to HTML' under the file
menu which is almost as convenient (Kate is a good editor too, I've
definitely made good use of it)
Never saw that; what editor do you use? Anyway, AFAIK KATE doesn't do
(and I *dare* you to call it a "lesser editor" :-)).
The also excellent SubEthaEdit also can copy with styles, or copy
"into" raw XHTML, which is kind of a neat trick à la enscript. (can
directly paste into a web page's source, don't have to rely on a GUI
editor to convert the styled text)
But anyway, my point is that this is not hard to do.
PS In a modern email reader, you will probably see a ` accent on the
"à la" above. But perhaps we shouldn't support other languages'
characters because that would be non-homogenous in older consoles
which don't support it, and english speakers don't like to see funny
accents in their ASCII text.
I know I'm baiting there, but hopefully you see the relation? Time
marches on, and there are better ways to do things.