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Re: problems with XFree
- From: Harold L Hunt II <huntharo at msu dot edu>
- To: dforeman at stny dot rr dot com, cygwin-xfree at cygwin dot com
- Date: Tue, 23 Jul 2002 15:29:27 -0400
- Subject: Re: problems with XFree
- References: <NEBBKCGPGLGENLAGHNDJIEHLDDAA.dforeman@stny.rr.com>
Dennis,
Dennis Foreman wrote:
Harold,
My problems are not with the code base and hence the implementation, but
rather the lack of conformity between the different implementations as to
the arguments allowed. If you know your UNIX history, you know that what
hurt its widespread usage most was the inability of developers to rely upon
consistent implementations. Different arguments, different actions,
different shells, different everything else makes for lovely sandboxes, but
hardly provides a basis for widely-accepted applications.
For future reference, just assume that I am an old timer.
You are completely allowed to have a problem with the difference between
the two implementations.
GNU, Linux, XFree86, and other open-source and free-software projects
were started partly in response to the fact that the UNIX industry had
failed miserably at maintaining any sort of compatibility with each
other. One major problem with closed-source UNIX operating systems is
that there are so many utilities in the operating system that not every
utility gets fixed in every release. In fact, you might be using a UNIX
release from 2002 that contains a version of sed that hasn't been
updated since 1990.
As I said before, if you are angry at Solaris for these discrepencies,
you can take it up with them. If you are angry that XFree86's xterm is
not compatible with Solaris's xterm, then you will have to take it up
with the xterm developers and see if you can convince them to make
changes on your behalf. Or, you can submit patch files to the xterm
maintainers, which they are much more likely to accept that mere talk of
changes.
With open-source and free-software you at least have the option of
contributing. Try contributing to Solaris's xterm and let us know how
far you get.
You need to realize that Cygwin/XFree86 is only a Cygwin port of
XFree86. For any general questions about XFree86 (such as those related
to xterm), *YOU HAVE TO TALK TO THE XFREE86 PROJECT*. The XFree86
project is located here:
http://xfree86.org/
If you have a problem with XFree86's xterm, *YOU HAVE TO TAKE IT UP WITH
THE XTERM MAINTAINER*:
http://dickey.his.com/xterm/xterm.html
I used to make a living designing OS's. It was fun. But the goal was always
to remember that we had CUSTOMERS (external-paying and internal-free) who
needed consistency from release to release and products that were compatible
across vendors. To remember that we needed to produce programs with the same
core set of options, clear delineation of 'vendor-specific options' and most
of all, user-friendly support that recognized that not all users should have
to be guru's. If you want to stop people from using something, try making
them feel stupid. Then no one will really care if yours is the best.
Sure. I have written a User's Guide for the Cygwin-specific XFree86
features. The XFree86 project has extensive documentation for all
XFree86 programs, libraries, extensions, etc.
I will be perfectly willing to give you support if you are willng to pay
me the same rate for support that you are used to forking over to
commerical UNIX vendors. However, no amount of blather coming from
anyone will convince me that my time is better spent in front of my
computer than with my fiance.
This is my hobby, not my livelihood.
PS. I apologize for sending email directly to you. As a user of many lists,
I did not think it necessary to look at the "to" line in my mail pgm to see
the actual recipient. My own list programs automatically modify the header
before sending posts to the list-members. Since I am OBVIOUSLY a MS Windows
user, one MIGHT expect that I also use MS Outlook, which does NOT give me
anything but "reply" and "reply to all". That doesn't make it inferior, just
different.
Wow.
Did you miss the fact that I am writing an X Window System server for
Microsoft Windows? Doesn't that sort of imply that I primarily use Windows?
Microsoft Outlook? Yup, I use that too. I hit reply-to-all and I swap
the addresses and remove addresses as necessary. I do the same thing in
Mozilla.
PPS. My proposed "patch" is for the installation of Xfree (by setup) to
modify the cygwin.bat file to include the Xfree86 directory in the user's
path. Which is what I did manually. (You might include a check to see if
it's been moved.) This adds no cost to non-Xfree users and is necessary
anyway for those who do use Xfree. OS/2 used to have a line in some of its
install programs asking if the user wanted certain files modified for them
(like config.sys).
regards,
D. J. Foreman, Ph. D.
Dept of Computer Science
Binghamton University
website: http://WWW.CS.Binghamton.EDU/~foreman
We have at times debated whether or not to add /usr/X11R6/bin to the
path in cygwin.bat. I do not recall where the discussion about that
left off. You can search the mailing list archives and let us know.
Then you can make the proposed change to cygwin.bat, run ``diff -U3
cygwin.bat > cygwin.bat.diff'' and submit that patch to
cygwin@cygwin.com for comments.
Harold