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RE: asp assistance please
- To: <xsl-list at mulberrytech dot com>
- Subject: RE: asp assistance please
- From: "Paulo Gaspar" <paulo dot gaspar at krankikom dot de>
- Date: Fri, 7 Jul 2000 17:21:08 +0200
- Reply-To: xsl-list at mulberrytech dot com
First I present my credentials on this issue:
- As some of you might have noticed, I have been using a lot of
Microsoft tools, including MSXML... with Borland's Delphi ISAPI
extensions. I also have a lot experience with ASPs (argh!) IIS,
ADO, COM and many other Microsoft tools and technologies.
- On the other hand, I have not been so noisy in this mailing list
during the last few weeks because I made the jump to Java/Oracle
stuff and I am going trough another technology absorption shock.
Now...
- This Delphi/MSXML/MS-stuff match is a symptom that I am not a
"Microsoft man" but that I have no complexes about using Microsoft
stuff;
- This jump to Java based technologies gives the practical knowledge
about why you, the Java guys, love it so much;
- And both things give me a clear notion of the problems that
Pawson's colleague could be facing.
There are 2 ways of facing this:
1. Pawson's colleague fights servlets or JSPs;
2. Pawson fights MSXML.
If the target is to make some long term work, I would advise the 1st
option because:
- JSPs are quite similar to ASPs;
- Even Servlets are quite easy and a bit familiar to a ASP
programmer, with its Response/Request parameters;
- Enough Java to build simple servlets is not so hard to learn,
especially if he knows some JScript and if you have some Servlet
templates or a Java tool with a wizard that produces them.
However:
- This only works on a long term basis because of the server itself.
Configuring a sever for Java can take more time to learn than all
the rest. Even JRun 2 (that couples with IIS) is tricky to
configure, in my experience.
If the target is only to execute the "stylesheet sara.xsl to produce
sara.html" using "a single parameter 'forms=true' or forms='false'",
than I am sure that the option 2 (Pawson fights MSXML) is the one
requiring less effort, since:
- If Pawson's colleague is familiar with ASPs and the use of COM
objects, the programmatic aspects of calling MSXML are quite simple
and there is a lot of documentation and samples on how to do it,
both from Microsoft and 3rd party publications;
- "MSXML Technology Preview - May 2000" is much closer to the
standards then previous releases - which eases Pawson's troubles
when comparing with the initial MSXML edition.
Pros and cons of MSXML3 - May 2000:
- MSXML 3 May 2000 already implements hard misses from previous
editions like "xsl:import", "xsl:include" and a lot of XPath axis;
(Although I am not sure if a couple of this axis aren't still
missing.)
- I think others (e.g. Michael Kay) might be better qualified to
talk about what features are missing for MSXML to meet the standard,
but I think that most issues should be easy to work around;
- The most limitative issue that I see being raised about MSXML is
that you can not reliably reference XML HTTP based sources when
using MSXML on a server application. (For me, this is its most
stupid limitation.) This limits including or importing XML trough
HTTP, but I think that you can still use server (e.g. ASP) generated
XML and transform it using local file stored XSL by using the "XSL
ISAPI Filter 2".
How to start using the thing:
- I advise downloading the MSXML May 2000 edition. You can find the
link to its page from Microsoft's "XML Developer Centre" page:
http://msdn.microsoft.com/xml
It is currently at the top right corner with a big picture;
- Download both the parser ("Download the May 2000 MSXML Technology
Preview Release (427 KB)") and its documentation ("Download the
latest MSXML Technology Preview SDK (1.1 MB)");
(You will find this MSXML help quite easy to use and complete,
although not 100% complete (especially in samples) or exact.)
- Also check the Bug List page. You have a link for it in the same
page where you have the above links;
- If you have Internet Explorer, check the (MS HTML format) help file
in the SDK for instructions on how to install MSXML3 in replace
mode. This will allow you to easily check XSL transformations using
static files with IE and this version of MSXML;
(Check "XML Developer's Guide"/"XML DOM User Guide"/"Running Msxml3
in Replace Mode".)
- Samples on programmatic use of MSXML can be found in Microsoft's
site but there are a lot of extra samples in:
http://www.asptoday.com/
They have an XML topic page there.
- I think that the "XSL ISAPI Filter 2" could also prove interesting.
Check the http://msdn.microsoft.com/xml page also for this one.
The above stuff can help some one else going trough the MSXML dilemma.
(This is an excuse for writing so much!)
But to Pawson, I owe more than that. His FAQ helped me a lot on starting
with XSL... and I am not the only one in this situation.
So, Mr. Pawson, feel free to mail me with further questions if you want.
Have fun,
Paulo Gaspar
(paulo.gaspar@krankikom.de)
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-xsl-list@mulberrytech.com
> [mailto:owner-xsl-list@mulberrytech.com]On Behalf Of Pawson, David
> Sent: Friday, July 07, 2000 08:34
> To: 'xsl-list@mulberrytech.com'
> Subject: RE: asp assistance please
>
>
>
>
> Personally I think that ASP/MSXML is
> >so much easier to use why would you bother with Saxon, but
> >I'm willing to admit it's a personal preference.
>
> Easier than what please??
>
> An off line judgement I made, which I'm willing to repeat.
> If Saxon doesn't do what you expect, chances are its wrong.
> If MS 'doesn't, my first reaction is 'what hasn't been implemented.
>
> that makes a difference to me, certainly today, and will do until
> MS declared compliance nearer to 100%.
>
> My 2 penneth, DaveP
>
>
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>
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